Solar heat vs Shop Heat

[willyswagon]

I see that the Shop heat thread was getting off track with the start of a Solar chat. I figured I'd try to get people to talk about it here rather the have Jan lose it!! and drop the Mod Hammer.

It is presently -18 C with a wind chill of -31 C. The Cansolair Solar Max system seems to be holding it's own today. The oil thermostats are set at 17.5 degrees C, but the Solar panel is keeping the temperature up to 19.5 C throughout the house(2 story, 1000sq ft/level). The air coming out of the panel vent is @ 40 degrees C. The benefit of this system is that it will put heat into the mass, walls, floors, etc all day. It stops the need for the furnace coming on during the day when the temperature hits the day time setting on your thermostat is reached. It also reduces the amount of oil that would normally be used to heat up your home when you come home after work and turn up your heat.

This is the 1st real cold day for the system, so far I'm happy.

The Thermo Dynamics Solar Boiler has produced about 20 gal of domestic water to a temperature of 45 degrees C. It will propably squeeze about another 5 gals today.

The facts with these systems are simple NO SUN = NO HEAT!!
They are great ways to reduce your oil or electrical dependance for heating, but won't replace it.

[mostheman]

Moved over from Shop Heat thread

Now that were on to solar heating and the like I can add again.....these are more of a design mindset and are not low buck but interesting none the less when talking about non traditional methods.

Heres the Solar Nova Scotia website which has lots of info on passive solar heating and what not. They offer a solar shelter manual( which i have if any one wants to look at it ). THe website has some in service buildings that use the passive heating principles. Also good links on here.

www.solarns.ca

Halifax design firm for eco-friendlyness www.solterre.com/philosophy.php

Theres a leading solar energy manufacturer/distributer right in burnside.

www.secondsourcepower.com/contact.php

Edited for spelling and sentence structure mess I had.

Passive solar would be a poor method of heating a shop as there would be several design consessions that could be made in a house that you wouldn't want in a shop.....like lots of tall windows......ok in a house but in a garage it would let would be theives window shop while deciding what to take first.

A good non conventional method of construction that would aid in cutting your heating bill would be to build a structure using the thermal mass construction. Heres an example one in service in Gaspereau ( www.solarns.ca/ship.php)

Thermal mass House-within-a-house construction to isolate the outside wall from the inside wall. Outer wall is made of cinder blocks, then 5" of foam insulation separates it from the interior wall of cinder blocks; internal thermal mass is 2000 blocks with eight cubic yards of sand packed inside, then nine cubic yards of poured concrete. Non-insulated slab. ( There would be an air gap (filled with insulation) between the 2 walls and the inside of the blocks would be filled sand or concrete )

Scissor trusses isolate the ceiling from the roof. Wood-fired range in kitchen supplies heat and its hot water side coil provides DHW. (Domestic Hot Water)

House wiring is 12v, used for lighting and inverted at point of use.

Three 100-foot-long 4" pipes run through the ground to supply air at a constant temperature during summer and winter; the pressure to draw this air is buffered by the chimney. Designed exhaust fan not installed yet.

Water is pumped from a dug well to a surface tank whenever it's sunny; the pump is powered using two 50watt, 24V PV panels.

The electrical system for the house is charged using eight 85 watt PV panels installed vertically on the south exterior wall. The reason behind their vertical orientation is to collect radiation reflected from the winter snow. These eight panels charge 2 "Surrette deep cycle" batteries which are kept in a wooden box, vented for safety. The electricity comes from the panels and into a power optimizing unit called a "Solar Boost 50" which balances the incoming current with the voltage to output the most power in watts. The lights and appliances are mostly powered by the 12 volt supply, transmitted as Direct Current.

Purpose
To be off-grid entirely. Home for two adults, two children and a dog. Within financial constraints, renewable energy and earth-friendly in as many ways as practical, using simple systems whenever practical.

Economics & Performance
Cold days, 3~F drop over cold nights with no fire on., The PV system supplies > 40A on cold days., Entire electrical system cost was 8000$. (PV is Photovoltaic batterieselectricity by sunlight)

A second would be a straw bale structure as straw bales offer excellent insulation. At R 2.7 per inch, an eighteen-inch wide bale equals R-48. One California study indicated that such a "super-insulated" straw bale home could save as much as 75% of heating and cooling costs. Theres a few in service in NS one on the west coast of CB I'll have to dig through my emails to find out more.

Realistically for a shop these non traditional construction methods add alot to the initial costs of the project and if the garage is for storage and recreational use the owner may never recoup his investment in the heating savings.

[The Garagemahal]

With wind power or solar ( either hot water or electricity ), do you get tax breaks , or get some kind of discount from the government for using them ?

[willyswagon]

I think Nova Scotia has some great incentives combined with the federal programs. Here in PEI it isn't nearly as good.
I think unless your combined house hold income is less then $24/ yr our getting DRY HUMPED!!
I put the Water solar system in 5 yrs ago before there were programs here.
My energy aduit was to old to be used as part of the air to air system, and I wasn't about to pay to have another one done($200) to save $200 on the purchase of this system

PS The cansolair just shut off for the day. It is 19 C in the house, -16C outside. Yeah

[Jeepy]

Interested in the cansolair system, there's one on a house in Sackville but i wanted to hear some owner feedback. I don't have a good location on my house for one.

Could we see a pic of yours?

I like the idea of the one from northern tool as it powers itself. Good for my cottage as i'm several kms off the grid. Although i do have solar power I keep it off when away as the inverter draws some and for fire safety. Here's my solar setup, 3 X 18w panels, 3 x 750 CCA deep cycle batteries, 1000 watt inverter. Fridge, stove hot water are propane.

[Jeepy]

Jan 15, 2009 13:35:33 GMT -4 The Garagemahal said:

With wind power or solar ( either hot water or electricity ), do you get tax breaks , or get some kind of discount from the government for using them ?

I checked about a year ago and there were no incentives for wind or solar power. They do have some for solar hot water. I think they need to get with the times, at least knock the tax off such things.

[willyswagon]

Sure I will, but it means you'll have to sell me the Dana 44 front from the Scout 11.

Here's the front of the house, with both systems


And a closer one of the Cansolair Solar Max


Remember Dana 44s

[The Garagemahal]

Jan 15, 2009 14:10:43 GMT -4 Jeepy said:

Jan 15, 2009 13:35:33 GMT -4 The Garagemahal said:

With wind power or solar ( either hot water or electricity ), do you get tax breaks , or get some kind of discount from the government for using them ?

I checked about a year ago and there were no incentives for wind or solar power. They do have some for solar hot water. I think they need to get with the times, at least knock the tax off such things.

I have read that the some states offer as much as %40 , I thought Canada was supposed to be a "green " leader , with N.S. being the greenest

['Roach]

Jan 15, 2009 14:42:43 GMT -4 The Garagemahal said:

Jan 15, 2009 14:10:43 GMT -4 Jeepy said:

I checked about a year ago and there were no incentives for wind or solar power. They do have some for solar hot water. I think they need to get with the times, at least knock the tax off such things.

I have read that the some states offer as much as %40 , I thought Canada was supposed to be a "green " leader , with N.S. being the greenest

Yes, but in NS, "green" is government speak for "how can I tax most of the province to keep the HRM greenie lobby happy?"